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Profile Wormholio
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Message 4667 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 13:45:27 UTC
Last modified: 17 Jan 2007 | 14:44:14 UTC

Pirates@Home now has a new section - a Pirates' glossary

This is a wiki, which uses the same software which runs the Wikipedia. I've been working recently to integrate that software with the BOINC forums, so that if you are logged in on Pirates@Home then you are automagically authenticated to the wiki. Then there is no need for "halt, who goes there?" for you to make a contribution.

There are a few things I hope our crew will help me test. First of all, does it work as expected? There are probably many small things that need to be tweaked or altered, but what is really broken?

Next, I'd like to test permissions. I hope to be able to use this on a site where students and teachers work together on investigative projects. Teachers need to be able to performs some administrative tasks, as well as monitor what the students may be posting. We may only allow editing from teachers or students who've been with the program a while. It looks like this kind of separation of permissions is easily implemented, but I'd like to test the mechanism here. The details are posted under [[Configuring user permissions]].

As you can see, there is a quick way to link to the glossary from the forums. If you enclose a word in double square brackets (thus: [ [Grog] ], but without spaces between the brackets) then it is automatically turned into a link to the glossary, thus: [[Grog]]. It's exactly the same as making a (local) link in the wiki.

I've developed this for I2U2, but the 'plugin' which makes it work is more general, and would therefore allow any BOINC project to easily add a wiki, perhaps to provide further documentation or background about the project's research. But it's only useful if it works, and so we need to test it.

Thanks in advance for your help.

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Message 4668 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 14:59:35 UTC
Last modified: 17 Jan 2007 | 15:11:46 UTC

[[bilge rat]]

[[wench]]

[[Configuring interwiki linking]]


edit - well the links work!

[[spec!al Characte$]] seem to not work?
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Message 4670 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 15:21:59 UTC

I added something on [[Configuring user permissions]] talk page, had to confirm my email first.

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Message 4672 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 15:40:55 UTC - in response to Message 4670.

I added something on [[Configuring user permissions]] talk page, had to confirm my email first.


I'll respond on the talk page. Don't forget that ~~~~ is turned into a signature on talk pages.

How did the e-mail confirmation work? Was it the wiki which set it up and ran the dialogue, or was it through BOINC? I have it configured so that the fact that you have verified your e-mail in BOINC is conveyed over to the wiki, but I've not tried it in that detail.
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Message 4673 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 15:43:04 UTC - in response to Message 4668.

[[bilge rat]]

[[wench]]


Okay, but now someone needs to fill in the definitions for these,
and/or links to other sources.

[[spec!al Characte$]] seem to not work?

Aye, and it's for the best. The wiki has some limitations on what can be in a title and what cannot. But perhaps the BOINC forum code which makes the links here is not in tune with the wiki rules?

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Message 4674 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 15:46:09 UTC - in response to Message 4672.

How did the e-mail confirmation work? Was it the wiki which set it up and ran the dialogue, or was it through BOINC? I have it configured so that the fact that you have verified your e-mail in BOINC is conveyed over to the wiki, but I've not tried it in that detail.

Everything about the confirmation email was from inside the wiki. I don't remember having confirmed my email via BOINC, maybe I did in the old times of account keys...

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Message 4675 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 15:52:40 UTC - in response to Message 4674.

Everything about the confirmation email was from inside the wiki. I don't remember having confirmed my email via BOINC, maybe I did in the old times of account keys...


If you have not confirmed your e-mail address with BOINC then it will tell you this on both the home page and your account page.

And if you have, then the wiki should not ask for it. But I think I did not yet implement that bit. An item for round 2...



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Message 4676 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 16:42:47 UTC - in response to Message 4675.

And if you have, then the wiki should not ask for it. But I think I did not yet implement that bit.


I just implemented it. If your email address has been verified in BOINC then it should be considered to be verified in the wiki.

And if you are banned in BOINC then you are automatically in the "brig" on the wiki.

Both will of course need to be tested.


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Message 4677 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 17:08:13 UTC

On the Alphabetical Index, when clicking on any letter of which a word is in the Glossary, all other categories are shown as well (click A, you see C to M). Click on a letter above the last one in the Glossary and it shows nothing.

Shouldn't it also not show anything if I click A? As there is nothing starting with A. When I click C it should only show everything starting with C. etc.
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Message 4678 - Posted: 17 Jan 2007 | 17:37:51 UTC - in response to Message 4677.

On the Alphabetical Index, when clicking on any letter of which a word is in the Glossary, all other categories are shown as well (click A, you see C to M). Click on a letter above the last one in the Glossary and it shows nothing.

Shouldn't it also not show anything if I click A? As there is nothing starting with A. When I click C it should only show everything starting with C. etc.


I found this somewhat confusing at first too, but the way it seems to work is that if you click on C then it shows you entries starting with "C" and those that follow, up to filling a page or so. Since we don't have very many entries it seems like it's giving you everything, but after we fill this up a bit it may look more like what you expect.

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Message 4679 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 0:22:31 UTC
Last modified: 18 Jan 2007 | 0:23:43 UTC

Although my Recent average credit is now 0.94 (and thus effectively puts me into the seaman category), I was able to successfully create the [[BBCode Tags]] (BBCode Tags) page.

Is the casting (a.k.a. Pirates@Home permissions or cathegorization) not yet enforced?
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Message 4680 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 0:47:45 UTC - in response to Message 4667.
Last modified: 18 Jan 2007 | 0:51:21 UTC

Wormholio wrote:
Pirates@Home now has a new section - a Pirates' glossary

This is a wiki, [...] but what is really broken?

The Glossary link at the top & bottom of the pages is severely broken - points to nowhere ;-)

(It points to ".../glossary/" instead of ".../glossary" as in the message.
And sorry for slightly modifying what you actually said :-)

[edit]Ooops, I could swear by my cannon that the slashed link did initially not work, IE reported only "Page not found" or so. Maybe some browser magic is involved?[/edit]
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Message 4681 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 1:05:51 UTC - in response to Message 4679.

Although my Recent average credit is now 0.94 (and thus effectively puts me into the seaman category), I was able to successfully create the [[BBCode Tags]] page.


Thanks for testing this. It correctly put you in the category of seaman, but it seems that it still lets you edit because you are a 'user', and anybody who is a 'user' can edit. It looks like I need to change how the group permissions are implemented.

This is very useful. The threshold of a RAC of 1.0 was just picked out of my pirate hat, so I'm glad you ended up just under it. Thank you.

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Message 4682 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 1:44:54 UTC - in response to Message 4681.

Although my Recent average credit is now 0.94 (and thus effectively puts me into the seaman category), I was able to successfully create the [[BBCode Tags]] page.


I've made some changes which I hope will separate the seamen from the able_seamen and fix this. Please try it again.

(And thanks for the BBcode page. Too bad we now have 3 different markup schemes to deal with.)
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Message 4683 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 1:51:47 UTC - in response to Message 4682.
Last modified: 18 Jan 2007 | 1:53:04 UTC

I've made some changes which I hope will separate the seamen from the able_seamen and fix this. Please try it again.

I could see only the text without various tabs at the top. After clicking tiny edit link on the right side, I've got:
"This page has been locked to prevent editing.
You can view and copy the source of this page:"

Thanks for being successfully degraded to unable_seaman :-)
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Message 4684 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 4:03:19 UTC

[[Blame Misfit]]
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Message 4687 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 7:58:50 UTC - in response to Message 4683.

I've made some changes which I hope will separate the seamen from the able_seamen and fix this. Please try it again.

After clicking tiny edit link on the right side, I've got:
"This page has been locked to prevent editing.
You can view and copy the source of this page:"



Same here, but with my RAC I should be able to edit.
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Message 4688 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 8:57:01 UTC - in response to Message 4684.

[[Blame Misfit]]

I've tried hard, but was not allowed to :-)
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Message 4689 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 10:10:02 UTC - in response to Message 4687.

Same here, but with my RAC I should be able to edit.

I can edit. I just added an 'a' to the administrtors. ;)
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Message 4690 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 12:11:38 UTC

I can't even see the wiki type pages. I seem to get a properly formed URL, however it is just a blank page. I tried most of the links here as well as the link on the home page. I am using IE7 on windows XP, and firefox on FC6.
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Message 4691 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 12:36:10 UTC - in response to Message 4690.

I see that effect with Mozilla on multiple other pages, John. What if you immediately reload, do the pages load then? I think it's a caching/prefetch problem of the browser.

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Message 4692 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 12:57:53 UTC
Last modified: 18 Jan 2007 | 13:03:44 UTC

Pepo wrote:
Rusty on User talk:Rusty wrote:

[size=+1]User talk:Rusty[/size]
Hi there. You can leave messages for me here.

--Rusty 13:59, 17 January 2007 (EST)

I've tried, but while among the unable_seamen...


Capt'n, how is it done, if someone is not (yet) allowed to create / modify documents, is there some way how to put a question or leace a note (maybe to the user talk areas)?

And, from here to Glossary, is translation of user names (something like [[User:Rusty]]) possible?
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Message 4693 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 18:39:53 UTC - in response to Message 4692.

Pepo wrote:
how is it done, if someone is not (yet) allowed to create / modify documents, is there some way how to put a question or leave a note (maybe to the user talk areas)?


We have to see how the various permissions really work. I've modified the 'seaman' class so that they may create a talk page, but not create or edit an article. I now wonder if that also allows you to edit an existing talk page?

It would also be possible to allow a seaman to edit an existing page but not create a new one.

And, from here to Glossary, is translation of user names (something like [[User:Rusty]]) possible?


It should be, once I allow : as a character in the text. Let's see if that worked....

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Message 4694 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 18:54:34 UTC - in response to Message 4690.

I can't even see the wiki type pages. I seem to get a properly formed URL, however it is just a blank page. I tried most of the links here as well as the link on the home page. I am using IE7 on windows XP, and firefox on FC6.


I'm with John on this one. Can't see any of those pages. Totally blank. Special code to block viewing by members of me crew is it? ;-) Harrrr!

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Message 4695 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 19:24:37 UTC - in response to Message 4687.

Same here, but with my RAC I should be able to edit.


I see you in the wiki user database, but you are not listed as an 'able_seaman', though other users are.

The group assignment is made when you log in, so if you were already logged in to the wiki then the changes I made won't take effect until you log out and log back in.

To test this I've lowered the threshold to 0.90. Pepo, if you logout and then log in again you should be able to edit. Let me know.

If you still cannot edit then try logging out, visit the wiki, then log back in again. I have tried to make the logout clear both BOINC and wiki (by making them share the same PHP session, and then clearing the one session at logout) but this also should be tested.


It might be possible to check for changes in RAC at each connection, but this could increase the work load on the server side unless I can find a clever way to detect just recent changes. We might try this in any case.


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Message 4696 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 19:28:52 UTC - in response to Message 4695.

It might be possible to check for changes in RAC at each connection, but this could increase the work load on the server side unless I can find a clever way to detect just recent changes. We might try this in any case.

It's already checking user level on each connection, which I guess it's stored on the DB, so I don't see how it will cause more load.

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Message 4697 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 19:41:43 UTC - in response to Message 4696.

It's already checking user level on each connection, which I guess it's stored on the DB, so I don't see how it will cause more load.


On each connection it now just checks for a BOINC session, and if there is on then checks for an existing wiki session, then compares the authenticators, and if they match you are in. No further work.

When you first log in, or if the wiki session does not match the BOINC authentication, then it does a bit more. It then copies over BOINC information (like username, e-mail address and verification status) and checks RAC. We could do that on every connection, but it seems like overkill.

We could try it -- we can try all sorts of things. I have some concern about the load on the server, since the wiki code is more complicated than the BOINC code and therefore likely to require more cycles on the server. This may or may not be what is happening with JKeck and Kinguni - the server takes so long that the browser gives up. But that is just one hypothesis at this point.

It's the same software as is used on Wikipedia. Can those having problems getting even a single page try the Wikipedia? I'm sure they can read that, but let's be good scientifical pirates and verify.


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Message 4698 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 19:49:20 UTC - in response to Message 4697.

Because I can read German, it would seem Wikipedia censors its users and material. ;)

link.
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Message 4699 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 20:30:56 UTC - in response to Message 4693.

Rusty wrote:
We have to see how the various permissions really work. I've modified the 'seaman' class so that they may create a talk page, but not create or edit an article. I now wonder if that also allows you to edit an existing talk page?


And to test this I've returned the threshold to RAC > 1.0, so Pepo is again demoted to simply a 'seaman'.

(We'll have to think of a reward for him for this in the end...)


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Message 4700 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 21:03:58 UTC

Interesting. Logged out I reach the glossary fine. Logged in, instead or reaching a blank page, I now get this:


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Message 4701 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 21:41:41 UTC - in response to Message 4700.

Interesting. Logged out I reach the glossary fine. Logged in, instead or reaching a blank page, I now get this:


I tweaked how it finds you. Please try it now, when you get a chance. Thanks.


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Message 4702 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 21:58:02 UTC - in response to Message 4701.

Interesting. Logged out I reach the glossary fine. Logged in, instead or reaching a blank page, I now get this:


I tweaked how it finds you. Please try it now, when you get a chance. Thanks.



Same error Cap'n.

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Message 4703 - Posted: 18 Jan 2007 | 23:26:01 UTC - in response to Message 4699.
Last modified: 18 Jan 2007 | 23:27:42 UTC

Rusty wrote:
We have to see how the various permissions really work. I've modified the 'seaman' class so that they may create a talk page, but not create or edit an article. I now wonder if that also allows you to edit an existing talk page?

And to test this I've returned the threshold to RAC > 1.0, so Pepo is again demoted to simply a 'seaman'.

I've missed the powers borrowed... the only thing I can edit now are my prefereces.

Finally I've found the stuff page and saw that I'm the only real seaman. Then there are some few able_seamen and some admirality... Majority of pirates do not have a title yet (effectively black souls (or passengers) on a pirate ship) - is it because they did not yet enter the Glossary?

(We'll have to think of a reward for him for this in the end...)

No problem, I think a fairly sized treasure box filled with dubloons and some jewels and just a barrel of (Jord mother's) grog will make it good!
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Message 4704 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 0:32:57 UTC - in response to Message 4702.

Interesting. Logged out I reach the glossary fine. Logged in, instead or reaching a blank page, I now get this:


I tweaked how it finds you. Please try it now, when you get a chance. Thanks.



Same error Cap'n.

I changed my username back to Kinguni (took {pirate} off the end) and now I can access it just fine. I think the 2 part username may have caused the problem.
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Message 4705 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 0:44:03 UTC - in response to Message 4702.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 0:54:44 UTC

Kinguni {pirate} wrote:
Same error Cap'n.


I think I've figured it out, thanks to Pepo's link to the list of all users. When I try to pull up your user page I get:
Bad title

The requested page title was invalid, empty, or an incorrectly linked
inter-language or inter-wiki title. It may contain one more characters
which cannot be used in titles.


I suspect that the curly brackets in your name are allowed in a BOINC user name, but not by Mediawiki. And once your account is created on the wiki that name is fixed in stone. Then yer screwed.

This may well be the problem keeping JKeck out as well, and there are others who may have problems due to their name.

Let me see what I can do about this...

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Message 4706 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 0:56:08 UTC

Capt'n, my last eye sees you're mising the preview feature too...
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Message 4707 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 1:23:01 UTC - in response to Message 4705.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 1:23:19 UTC

Kinguni {pirate} wrote:
Same error Cap'n.


I think I've figured it out, thanks to Pepo's link to the list of all users. When I try to pull up your user page I get:
Bad title

The requested page title was invalid, empty, or an incorrectly linked
inter-language or inter-wiki title. It may contain one more characters
which cannot be used in titles.


I suspect that the curly brackets in your name are allowed in a BOINC user name, but not by Mediawiki. And once your account is created on the wiki that name is fixed in stone. Then yer screwed.

This may well be the problem keeping JKeck out as well, and there are others who may have problems due to their name.

Let me see what I can do about this...


Oh, I bet it was the {} then.
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Message 4709 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 2:10:43 UTC - in response to Message 4707.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 3:08:22 UTC

OK, now I get the db error again.

edit: But if I'm logged out from here, I can go to the glossary and show logged in as Kinguni.

Further edit: Can't log out from the Glossary. Really fubar here.

Current error when trying to access the glossary while logged in here only:


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Message 4711 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 2:44:42 UTC

24hrs ago I wasn't allowed to edit, but all good now.
And I now see user list page with Pepo as the only seaman. Travesty!
For sure when this is over Pepo must be promoted to Boatswain or maybe even Sailing Master.
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Message 4712 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 9:34:00 UTC - in response to Message 4711.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 9:39:06 UTC

I now see user list page with Pepo as the only seaman. Travesty!

I'm not alone anymore! Simek joined me!
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Message 4713 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 10:15:27 UTC

Give it another week and we'll all be there, Peter. All this lying in the harbor doesn't give us much to work on. ;)
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Message 4714 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 10:26:06 UTC

If we'd sail away, I could possibly fight for and collect some gold and then be promoted to "be able". (dreams)
But lying in harbor makes my wooden leg strike roots into the ground.
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Message 4715 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 10:32:33 UTC - in response to Message 4714.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 10:33:53 UTC

collect some gold

Thinking about that, shouldn't the Credits here be Gold and the RAC be RAG, RAB or RAL, Captain? (Recent Average Gold, Bullion or Loot)
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Message 4716 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 10:37:04 UTC - in response to Message 4715.

Thinking about that, shouldn't the Credits here be Gold and the RAC be RAG, Captain? (Recent Average Gold)

Fine idea! You can write a proposal of a description page in the Pirates' Glossary :-)
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Message 4717 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 12:47:07 UTC

I have adjusted the permissions again, to what I think matches better how the wiki applies them and how they might best be used here. A seaman can edit any existing page (unless it is protected) but may not create a new one, except if it is a talk page. An able_seaman can create a new page, and can also upload images, which a simple seaman cannot do.

And... working together works. If a seaman needs a new page created he may ask any able_seaman to do it. Once the page has been created the seaman may edit it.

At least this is how it looks like it will work. Does it really work that way?

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Message 4718 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 12:48:41 UTC - in response to Message 4715.

collect some gold

Thinking about that, shouldn't the Credits here be Gold and the RAC be RAG, RAB or RAL, Captain? (Recent Average Gold, Bullion or Loot)


I've heard somewhere credits from Pirates@Home refered to as [[Gold Dust]]

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Message 4719 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:30:52 UTC - in response to Message 4713.

Give it another week and we'll all be there, Peter. All this lying in the harbor doesn't give us much to work on. ;)


I'm interested to see if this really works as expected. As RAC decreases more members of the crew should change from able_seaman to seaman. But the change should only be made if they log out and log in again. An able_seaman who stays logged in on his browser even as his RAC drops below 1.0 should remain an able_seaman until at least the end of the browser session.

And we will be in the harbor for at least another week, since there is nothing ready yet for testing as far as applications. (I really could use some of those code dwarves :-)

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Message 4720 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:32:43 UTC - in response to Message 4718.

I've heard somewhere credits from Pirates@Home refered to as [[Gold Dust]]

It's only a myth, do not believe him! I can prove it!

[size=-2]Yes it seems to work as predicted.[/size]
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Message 4721 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:38:56 UTC - in response to Message 4719.

An able_seaman who stays logged in on his browser even as his RAC drops below 1.0 should remain an able_seaman until at least the end of the browser session.

Everyone immediately sets their Pirates cookies to never expire.... ;)
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Message 4722 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:44:46 UTC - in response to Message 4721.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:45:46 UTC

An able_seaman who stays logged in on his browser even as his RAC drops below 1.0 should remain an able_seaman until at least the end of the browser session.

Everyone immediately sets their Pirates cookies to never expire.... ;)

...and suddenly the Pirates' Glossary Bureaucrats will come with another idea requiring RAG > 1.59 to become (........)
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Message 4723 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:54:05 UTC - in response to Message 4722.

...and suddenly the Pirates' Glossary Bureaucrats will come with another idea requiring RAG > 1.59 to become (........)


Something like that. Now you need at least RAC > 0.01 (one "cobblepenny") to even become a seaman.


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Message 4724 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 13:59:24 UTC - in response to Message 4723.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 14:00:03 UTC

Now you need at least RAC > 0.01 (one "cobblepenny") to even become a seaman.

Right so. It possibly takes some time here, but seems to be necessary. At least at larger tankers, maybe not at tiny galeons.

One more idea - Glossary uses external links for instance to MediaWiki for e.g. Formatting. Could there be a requirement from closed-comunity to have internet-independent wiki? Or is it rather unusual?
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Message 4725 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 14:04:41 UTC - in response to Message 4724.

Right so. It possibly takes some time here, but seems to be necessary. At least at larger tankers, maybe not at tiny galeons.

Now I wonder why a galleon even needs a tanker... has the age of the oil-burning steamship arrived?
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Message 4726 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 14:34:06 UTC - in response to Message 4724.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 14:42:31 UTC

One more idea - Glossary uses external links for instance to MediaWiki for e.g. Formatting. Could there be a requirement from closed-comunity to have internet-independent wiki? Or is it rather unusual?


You mean on an intranet, closed off from the Internet? Yes, you could do this. You can have several wiki's tied together, and you could even perhaps get a copy of the MediaWiki content for documentation and serve it from an internal site. It's called Interwiki linking

It's also easy to make links to the other wikis which are tied together this way. You make a wiki link with the square brackets, but put a prefix before or between colons specifying the other wiki. The prefixes are configurable. So the link above would be coded in the wiki as [ [:mw:Help:Interwiki linking]].

(In the BOINC forums you can only use the double bracket shortcut to link to the wiki to which it is tied.)

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Message 4729 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 20:45:49 UTC

Drat it, I hits da glossary, on main page, this un's is what I gets. Did not eyeball any other similar comment in this thread. But I do need new trifocals.

Database error
A database query syntax error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software. The last attempted database query was:

(SQL query hidden)

from within function "User::addToDatabase". MySQL returned error "1048: Column 'user_name' cannot be null (localhost)".

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Message 4730 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 21:10:16 UTC - in response to Message 4729.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 21:23:22 UTC

Drat it, I hits da glossary, on main page, this un's is what I gets. Did not eyeball any other similar comment in this thread. But I do need new trifocals.

Database error
A database query syntax error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software. The last attempted database query was:

(SQL query hidden)

from within function "User::addToDatabase". MySQL returned error "1048: Column 'user_name' cannot be null (localhost)".

roark



edit - I just joined another host to the project and now I get the glossary page. DUH? - tide

edit edit- Double drat, if I'm logged in I get the database error. But if I log out then I can see the glossary. I can navigate thru the glossary as long as I do not log in, once I log in I get the data base error again on everything that I select.
Brig time for me as I missed the edjit button on the previous post. Grog me pleaseeeee.
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Message 4731 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 21:14:06 UTC - in response to Message 4729.

roark wrote:

from within function "User::addToDatabase". MySQL returned error "1048: Column 'user_name' cannot be null (localhost)".


I wonder if this is related to the fact that your username begins with a lower case letter. The wiki wants it upper case. I though that it would convert it, though your "Real Name" on the wiki would still be lower case.

If you are in, what is your username on the wiki, roark or Roark? And if you check your preferences what does it show for your Real Name?

I can see I need to look more carefully at how BOINC and the wiki deal with user names.

Thank for the report(s).
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Message 4732 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 21:48:17 UTC - in response to Message 4731.

I still can't get the glossary logged in Cap'n.
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Message 4733 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 22:01:13 UTC - in response to Message 4731.
Last modified: 19 Jan 2007 | 22:21:37 UTC

roark wrote:

from within function "User::addToDatabase". MySQL returned error "1048: Column 'user_name' cannot be null (localhost)".


I wonder if this is related to the fact that your username begins with a lower case letter. The wiki wants it upper case. I though that it would convert it, though your "Real Name" on the wiki would still be lower case.

If you are in, what is your username on the wiki, roark or Roark? And if you check your preferences what does it show for your Real Name?

I can see I need to look more carefully at how BOINC and the wiki deal with user names.

Thank for the report(s).


The preferences are in lower case and I do not show up in the "crew list" of users. Every time that I do log in, while in or out of the glossary, I database error out.
I will change the preferences to upper case to see what happens.

This is the second time I've entered this reply. I started the reply while I was logged in, then I logged out to look at the glossary, I then completed this entry. When I clicked "post reply", it required me to login, which I did, at that point it dropped all of my reply and I've re-typed this entry.

edit- Well I changed preferences to upper case and I still error out when I am logged in. Also when I was logged out and in the "Configuring User Permission" page i clicked on an 'edit' key and it asked me to log in with just my 'Email address and my password' it did not give me the alternative of using my 'account key'. Guess what I, normally use. -tide
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Message 4734 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 22:36:49 UTC

Right now we have a picky wiki which will not let you in if your BOINC user name has curly brackets in it or if your username does not begin with an upper case letter. And once you've tried to connect you are wedged. You can't get around it by changing your name in BOINC.

I will work on the code to find a way around this, but I can't do it right away. The right way to do it is to let the wiki software do the proper conditioning of the name, so that it gets exactly what it wants. I thought I had that set up, but some functions adjust text to match the requirement, while others return NULL if the text does not meet the requirement, and I may have mistaken one of these for the other.

I'll post here when I have something I'd like to test, and I'll then clear you from the wiki databse so you can start over. [[Heave to]] until then (and smoke 'em if you got 'em :-)

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Message 4735 - Posted: 19 Jan 2007 | 23:04:54 UTC - in response to Message 4734.

No big one Cap'n. Pleasure to help you work them bugs outta da system.
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Message 4736 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 1:14:49 UTC - in response to Message 4695.

Same here, but with my RAC I should be able to edit.


I see you in the wiki user database, but you are not listed as an 'able_seaman', though other users are.

The group assignment is made when you log in, so if you were already logged in to the wiki then the changes I made won't take effect until you log out and log back in.

To test this I've lowered the threshold to 0.90. Pepo, if you logout and then log in again you should be able to edit. Let me know.

If you still cannot edit then try logging out, visit the wiki, then log back in again. I have tried to make the logout clear both BOINC and wiki (by making them share the same PHP session, and then clearing the one session at logout) but this also should be tested.


It might be possible to check for changes in RAC at each connection, but this could increase the work load on the server side unless I can find a clever way to detect just recent changes. We might try this in any case.



It works and I didn't have to log out

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Message 4737 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 3:22:08 UTC

I'm still wedged. I did get to read the glossary by logging out. However even after changing my name I get an error when trying to access it logged in. I do get error 500 messages now instead of just a blank screen, so at least some progress has been made.
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Message 4740 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 6:00:38 UTC - in response to Message 4734.

Right now we have a picky wiki which will not let you in if your BOINC user name has curly brackets in it or if your username does not begin with an upper case letter. And once you've tried to connect you are wedged. You can't get around it by changing your name in BOINC.

I don't have curly brackets, and I do have an upper case first letter, but I'm getting the same error message as reported. If I log off and go directly to the wiki, I can read. But if I wanted to experiment in there, I have to log in and then get the error again.

Have fun following the treasure map to the solution!

MJ
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Message 4741 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 7:39:35 UTC
Last modified: 20 Jan 2007 | 7:40:22 UTC

MJ and DJ (seem like a pair. ;)), which browser(s) are you using? Did you try to delete your browser cache? Did you restart the browser after purging the cache?

John, your name John Keck {pirate} is still in the list on the Glossary. I think I read in this thread that Eric said changing your name won't matter, you're now coded into the Wiki using that name. Unless you try to detach and re-attach. The scheduler is up&running, so that should be a possibility.
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Message 4742 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 8:59:07 UTC - in response to Message 4741.

Unless you try to detach and re-attach. The scheduler is up&running, so that should be a possibility.


I just tried that with no luck.
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Message 4746 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 21:53:24 UTC
Last modified: 20 Jan 2007 | 21:55:20 UTC

I've tried a few times to check out the glossary and all I ever get is a "HTTP 500" error.

It makes one feel like Charlie Brown... "All I got was a rock" :P
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Message 4747 - Posted: 20 Jan 2007 | 22:41:04 UTC - in response to Message 4741.
Last modified: 20 Jan 2007 | 23:02:33 UTC

MJ and DJ (seem like a pair. ;)), which browser(s) are you using? Did you try to delete your browser cache? Did you restart the browser after purging the cache?


My normal browser is Firefox 1.5.0.9. Just tried deleting the cache now and got the same error, though I didn't restart it.

I also tried in Exploder 6. Same result, except the error message was the IE standard HTTP 500 - Internal server error rather than the SQL error. If I go from the error back to the Pirates site and log off, I can then get to the glossary with no problem. Clear the cache and no change. Restart after clearing, no change. I just can't get then when I'm logged in.

[edit]I just browsed parts of the glossary while not logged in. I tried clicking on an "edit" link, as if to edit a page. Was told I needed to be logged in for that, and that took me to a different login than the Pirates@Home login. When I tried, it didn't recognize either my name (MJKelleher), or my email address as a user. If I use the login at the upper right corner of the page, I'm back here and then can't get into the glossary again.[/edit]

MJ
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Message 4749 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 1:45:38 UTC
Last modified: 21 Jan 2007 | 1:52:00 UTC

I was able to get in while logged in today. Did you change something Eric? or did the username change finally propagate.

I did not turn up as seaman, able or otherwise, though.

edit: logging out and back in gave me that able-bodied tag.
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Message 4750 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 2:01:05 UTC - in response to Message 4749.
Last modified: 21 Jan 2007 | 2:02:16 UTC

I was able to get in while logged in today. Did you change something Eric? or did the username change finally propagate.

I did not turn up as seaman, able or otherwise, though.

edit: logging out and back in gave me that able-bodied tag.

What's interesting: I looked at the stuff page 2 hours ago and again now, but there is still neither JKeck nor Dirty John username. Where did you see your able-bodied tag? (Some other page I missed?)
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Message 4751 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 2:56:58 UTC

Something changed, somewhere along the way... I can get in now, go figure!

MJ
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Message 4752 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 3:00:43 UTC - in response to Message 4749.

JKeck wrote:
I was able to get in while logged in today. Did you change something Eric? or did the username change finally propagate.


While you were changing your user name to remove the curly brackets, we were changing the code so that it deals properly with names that have characters the wiki doesn't like.

It should work for everybody now.

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Message 4753 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 3:42:40 UTC - in response to Message 4752.


It should work for everybody now.

It works.
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Message 4757 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 19:31:45 UTC

Aye, Cap'n! I got in and made a small addition to the section on gold dust. It worked fine and was very easy to use. That is all... SIR!
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Message 4758 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 19:32:52 UTC

Wow. Code dwarves really do exist.
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Message 4759 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 21:47:21 UTC

With my account everything worked well from the beginning on. I could read, write and load up pictures.
The only thing I do not understand is that everybody with editing rights may edit everyones userpage. i think this does not make sense.
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Message 4760 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 21:50:31 UTC - in response to Message 4758.

Wow. Code dwarves really do exist.


I just heard some rumor about their everlasting arch enemies: the rampaging code goblins. I will try to find out more about them.

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Message 4761 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 22:43:39 UTC - in response to Message 4750.

I was able to get in while logged in today. Did you change something Eric? or did the username change finally propagate.

I did not turn up as seaman, able or otherwise, though.

edit: logging out and back in gave me that able-bodied tag.

What's interesting: I looked at the stuff page 2 hours ago and again now, but there is still neither JKeck nor Dirty John username. Where did you see your able-bodied tag? (Some other page I missed?)

It was on that page. Dirty John is still there, the seaman tag is missing now though.
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Message 4762 - Posted: 21 Jan 2007 | 23:11:58 UTC - in response to Message 4761.

It was on that page. Dirty John is still there, the seaman tag is missing now though.

Yes, I saw it now.
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Message 4763 - Posted: 22 Jan 2007 | 0:45:45 UTC - in response to Message 4759.

The only thing I do not understand is that everybody with editing rights may edit everyones userpage. i think this does not make sense.


The general idea of the wiki is that everybody can edit everything, more or less (if they are allowed to edit at all).

Aside from the technical limitations of who is allowed to do what, there can also be social conventions which keep things functioning smoothly. (The social conventions are probably more important than mere technical limitations.)

I agree that it's probably not proper form to edit someone else's user page. Just as each article has a discussion page for "behind the scenes" discussion of what should or shouldn't go on a page, each user page has a "talk" page where users can leave messages. Leave somebody else's user page alone, but feel free to leave a message on their talk page.

For each page there is a record of all changes and who made them, and anonymous edits are not allowed here. You can set a watch on any page to receive an e-mail notification of edits. So it's at least easy to monitor who may be making changes to someone else's user page, and that in itself may prevent abuse.

But I agree, you might think that each user would be the only one who could edit their own User page. There are many 'extensions' to the basic code which implement functionality above and beyond the basics. It might be that there is an extension which provides this kind of limit.

An extension I found interesting is [[m:Talkright]], which allows someone to edit a talk page even if they are not allowed to edit articles in general. We may try this out as a way for the crew with no RAC to still participate.
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Message 4764 - Posted: 22 Jan 2007 | 0:50:01 UTC - in response to Message 4763.
Last modified: 22 Jan 2007 | 0:50:24 UTC

An extension I found interesting is [[m:Talkright]], which allows...

Inter-wiki links don't work inside BOINC forums, it seems...

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Message 4765 - Posted: 22 Jan 2007 | 0:53:39 UTC - in response to Message 4764.

An extension I found interesting is [[m:Talkright]], which allows...

Inter-wiki links don't work inside BOINC forums, it seems...


Yup, I forgot. Except that I did make a modification so that at least interwiki links to wikipedia work. Saying [ [w:Heave to]] give the link [[w:Heave to]].
I suppose it could be extended to all interwiki linking, but then the BOINC project would need access to the wiki database which contains the links, and I don't think it would be worth all the complication.

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Message 4766 - Posted: 22 Jan 2007 | 14:59:59 UTC


Was able to get into the glossary today, but could neither create a new article nor edit existing articles (thought that 'Captain Blood' was a must add to the nautical movies list) even though my RAC was 1.50. The list of users also gave no parenthetical title beside my entry and many others. Is there some time delay before that is added?

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Message 4767 - Posted: 22 Jan 2007 | 17:19:05 UTC - in response to Message 4766.

(thought that 'Captain Blood' was a must add to the nautical movies list)

I posted it for you, as a test of my editing privileges. Seemed to work fine.
____________

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Message 4768 - Posted: 22 Jan 2007 | 18:17:06 UTC - in response to Message 4766.

Was able to get into the glossary today, but could neither create a new article nor edit existing articles (thought that 'Captain Blood' was a must add to the nautical movies list) even though my RAC was 1.50. The list of users also gave no parenthetical title beside my entry and many others. Is there some time delay before that is added?


There is no time delay, but the assignment as seaman or able_seaman is made only when you log in. So perhaps you had visited the glossary earlier, just for a look, before I had altered the code, so you already had a session running. Try logging out and logging in again to see if it gets it right.

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Message 4769 - Posted: 23 Jan 2007 | 3:47:50 UTC - in response to Message 4768.

There is no time delay, but the assignment as seaman or able_seaman is made only when you log in. So perhaps you had visited the glossary earlier, just for a look, before I had altered the code, so you already had a session running. Try logging out and logging in again to see if it gets it right.


Arrrgh Cap'n! twer right on the spot with that as twas smooth sail'in from the vessel at my home port (my office ship had already plied those waters before).

@Odysseus
Thanks!

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Message 4800 - Posted: 29 Jan 2007 | 0:15:20 UTC
Last modified: 29 Jan 2007 | 0:24:04 UTC

Capt'n, rocks on the left side!!

I've noticed another issue. I tried to log out, then (for the first time as a visitor) to take a look at our forum, then the Glossary. I've tried to edit the Gold Dust page and was asked to log in first:

You have to log in to edit pages.
Return to Gold Dust.
Retrieved from "http://pirates.spy-hill.net/glossary/index.php/Gold_Dust"

In that moment I did not knew (never tried before) that the "usual" login would redirect me to Pirates' forum login. So I was asked to:
[size=+2]Log in[/size]

You must have cookies enabled to log in to Pirates@Home.
Username: __________
Password: __________

[x] Remember my login on this computer

[ Log in ] [ E-mail password ]

and then
[size=+1]Log in / create account[/size]
From Pirates@Home
Jump to: navigation, search
[size=+1]Login error:[/size]
Incorrect password entered. Please try again.

again and again. Neither my nickname (a.k.a. Glossary's user name) nor my e-mail address worked.

I had to log in through the Pirates' forum login page. Only later I noticed that the [ login ] link in the upper right corner was ought for it. Probably some shortcut around the rocky login reef to the usual login lagoon would be fine.
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Message 4802 - Posted: 29 Jan 2007 | 2:17:33 UTC - in response to Message 4800.

Capt'n, rocks on the left side!!...


Yes, this is something I've known about, but have not yet had time to fix. I was able to get the login/logout links in the upper right corner to go to the correct place (for the BOINC project) but the wiki also has it's own 'internal' links to it's own login page when it wants you to login (as you have seen).

I suspect there are some internal hooks in the software which will let me redirect these links, but I've not yet tracked them down.

Meanwhile, it's good to have this in the log, so that users know of the problem. Thank you.

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Message 4943 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007 | 13:07:09 UTC - in response to Message 4802.

I suspect there are some internal hooks in the software which will let me redirect these links, but I've not yet tracked them down.


I have now figured out how to do this. One needs to add one hook to the function which checks that a user is logged in to the wiki. I'll be proposing that addition to the MediaWiki developers.

So now when the wiki wants you to log in it will direct you to the BOINC login page, not the (non-functional) wiki login page.

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Message 4946 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007 | 18:46:46 UTC - in response to Message 4943.

I have now figured out how to do this. One needs to add one hook to the function which checks that a user is logged in to the wiki....

So now when the wiki wants you to log in it will direct you to the BOINC login page, not the (non-functional) wiki login page.

Except that a recent test shows that it's not yet completely working....
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Message 4949 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007 | 20:49:18 UTC - in response to Message 4684.
Last modified: 19 Feb 2007 | 20:52:05 UTC

[[Blame Misfit]]

This is what I see
However I'm able to access the links at the top.

But even though it looks like I'm logged in...

Page creation limited
From Pirates@Home (<--- where did this)
Jump to: navigation, search (<--- come from?)

This site has restricted the ability to create new pages. You can go back and edit an existing page, or log in or create an account.
____________

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Message 4950 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007 | 20:53:44 UTC - in response to Message 4949.

From Pirates@Home (<--- where did this)
Jump to: navigation, search (<--- come from?)

This doesn't show up on my screen but is there when I cut and paste.
____________

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Message 4955 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007 | 23:59:40 UTC - in response to Message 4949.

[[Blame Misfit]]

This is what I see

And unfortunately if you get this page you are already screwed. No matter what password you enter it won't work, because the password in the database has been altered to facilitate authentication via BOINC. You have to login to the BOINC part of the site first, then go to the wiki.

I put a hook in the wiki code which was supposed to redirect you to the right place if authentication is required, but it seems it does not work in all cases. Thanks for probing the limits (as usual).

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Message 4956 - Posted: 20 Feb 2007 | 0:25:40 UTC - in response to Message 4955.

...
Thanks for probing the limits (as usual).


That's why we blame him. Maybe a new plank walking for him?






____________
[color=navy][size=12][b]Those who can, do. Those who can't, bully.[/b][/size][/color]
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Message 4957 - Posted: 20 Feb 2007 | 1:07:07 UTC - in response to Message 4955.

I put a hook in the wiki code which was supposed to redirect you to the right place if authentication is required, but it seems it does not work in all cases.


Misfit's mishap has shown that there's another way a user can get mis-directed to the wiki's "Userlogin" page. There are a number of system messges which contain in them links to that page. Fortunately, it's relatively easy to edit this messages (they are also wiki pages) to take out those links. I have done so, and so hopefully that will prevent further misdirection.

If you find other wiki pages which say something that seems out of place, especially with regard to having to log in to do something, please report them.


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Message 4958 - Posted: 20 Feb 2007 | 4:36:24 UTC - in response to Message 4955.

[[Blame Misfit]]

This is what I see

And unfortunately if you get this page you are already screwed. No matter what password you enter it won't work, because the password in the database has been altered to facilitate authentication via BOINC. You have to login to the BOINC part of the site first, then go to the wiki.

I put a hook in the wiki code which was supposed to redirect you to the right place if authentication is required, but it seems it does not work in all cases. Thanks for probing the limits (as usual).

I'm automatically logged in when I come here via permanent cookie.
____________

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Message 4966 - Posted: 20 Feb 2007 | 13:06:08 UTC - in response to Message 4958.
Last modified: 20 Feb 2007 | 13:06:32 UTC

I'm automatically logged in when I come here via permanent cookie.

And that cookie will authenticate you to the wiki as well.

But with RAC < 1.0 you can only edit existing pages, not create new ones.

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Message 4969 - Posted: 21 Feb 2007 | 23:24:35 UTC - in response to Message 4966.
Last modified: 21 Feb 2007 | 23:30:56 UTC

I'm automatically logged in when I come here via permanent cookie.

And that cookie will authenticate you to the wiki as well.

But with RAC < 1.0 you can only edit existing pages, not create new ones.


Then give us some gold!

I am not able to edit the "Wench" page. I think I have the qualifications and abilities to elaborate on that subject!

And I'm also permanently logged on via a cookie.


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Message 4971 - Posted: 22 Feb 2007 | 0:32:15 UTC

There is now a page called [[Wench]]. You can go edit it.
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Message 4974 - Posted: 23 Feb 2007 | 14:37:42 UTC - in response to Message 4969.

I am not able to edit the "Wench" page. I think I have the qualifications and abilities to elaborate on that subject!


Fuzzy.

I'm not exactly sure why you refer to yourself as a "wench". It's an extremely demeaning way to refer to a woman.

But hey. If that's how you see yourself, then so be it. It's not a term I like so you're welcome to edit the page.

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Message 4978 - Posted: 23 Feb 2007 | 22:34:14 UTC

Every page on the wiki has an accompanying "talk" page (reached by the "annotations" tab at the top of the page), the purpose of which is to discuss what should or should not be put in the article itself, or how best to phrase things, or which things to emphasize, etc.

I belive I have the wiki configured so that any member of the crew can create a "talk" page, even with RAC < 1.0 or even 0.01. And a quick check shows that right now even anonymous visitors can contribute to existing talk pages (but not create new ones). I'll change that if there is a problem with abuse (we can blame Misfit), but my interest is more to see how I can control access, rather than specific issues of content.

Please feel free to try out the talk pages, and use them as might be appropriate to disucuss what should go in a particular article.

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Message 4979 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 2:23:01 UTC - in response to Message 4974.

I'm not exactly sure why you refer to yourself as a "wench". It's an extremely demeaning way to refer to a woman.

But hey. If that's how you see yourself, then so be it. It's not a term I like so you're welcome to edit the page.

And once this project is called Politically_Correct@home I won't be rotting in the brig. Instead I'll be a detained guest.
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Message 4981 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 7:25:37 UTC - in response to Message 4974.
Last modified: 24 Feb 2007 | 7:28:29 UTC

I am not able to edit the "Wench" page. I think I have the qualifications and abilities to elaborate on that subject!


Fuzzy.

I'm not exactly sure why you refer to yourself as a "wench". It's an extremely demeaning way to refer to a woman.

But hey. If that's how you see yourself, then so be it. It's not a term I like so you're welcome to edit the page.



Eric Myers, is a post like the one, I'm replying to, within these rules?

# No messages intended to annoy or antagonize other people, or to hijack a thread.
# No messages that are deliberately hostile or insulting.
# No abusive comments involving race, religion, nationality, gender, class or sexuality.


I see you have posted after it, so I assume you have seen it.

Is this the way you want your board ruled from now on? Hostile, insulting, abusive, and harassing posts to certain users are allowed and won't be moderated? Maybe they are even endorsed by you?

I feel this post very offensive to my person! Please explain to me why this post hasn't been moderated, neither by your moderators nor by yourself. Thank you very much.

And for the record I have used the red-x on it several times and it's still there.


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Message 4984 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 15:30:21 UTC - in response to Message 4981.

Fuzzy wrote:
is a post like the one I'm replying to within these rules?


There are a number of issues here. There was no way for me to know you found the posting offensive until you said you did, and I still don't know if that was the intention of the poster. It's quite possible she was just pointing out that there is another meaning to the word in question. Only she can speak to her true intentions.

In part, I think this disagreement stems from the fact that there are several meanings of the 'W-word'. Amongst pirates (or people playing at pirates) it can just be used in place of "woman" (though generally not for a female pirate). But as has been pointed out, the more general sense is in fact derogatory (as is being called a pirate, by the way). I believe you were using the word in the first sense while she was pointing out that it has the other meaning as well.

Explaining all meanings and contexts is exactly the purpose of a glossary, and since nobody else has taken on the task I have filled in that entry: [[Wench]] The crew can, of course, edit it to improve upon my start.

In general, my policy is that unless abuse is clear and intended, or unless something is quite clearly offensive, then there is no need to remove a post. When there is some doubt, I'll leave it there, as will the moderators, at least until that doubt is removed. Other members of the crew can then judge a person by what they write -- all of it, both good and bad -- and we can have a mature discussion between all pirates and wenches.

But if things get out of hand I'm happy to try out the brig again...

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Message 4987 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 16:23:46 UTC - in response to Message 4984.
Last modified: 24 Feb 2007 | 16:31:50 UTC

Fuzzy wrote:
is a post like the one I'm replying to within these rules?


There are a number of issues here. There was no way for me to know you found the posting offensive until you said you did, and I still don't know if that was the intention of the poster. It's quite possible she was just pointing out that there is another meaning to the word in question. Only she can speak to her true intentions.

In part, I think this disagreement stems from the fact that there are several meanings of the 'W-word'. Amongst pirates (or people playing at pirates) it can just be used in place of "woman" (though generally not for a female pirate). But as has been pointed out, the more general sense is in fact derogatory (as is being called a pirate, by the way). I believe you were using the word in the first sense while she was pointing out that it has the other meaning as well.

Explaining all meanings and contexts is exactly the purpose of a glossary, and since nobody else has taken on the task I have filled in that entry: [[Wench]] The crew can, of course, edit it to improve upon my start.

In general, my policy is that unless abuse is clear and intended, or unless something is quite clearly offensive, then there is no need to remove a post. When there is some doubt, I'll leave it there, as will the moderators, at least until that doubt is removed. Other members of the crew can then judge a person by what they write -- all of it, both good and bad -- and we can have a mature discussion between all pirates and wenches.

But if things get out of hand I'm happy to try out the brig again...


It that is so, how come Misfit's reply to the same post has been deleted? You know very well it has been deleted, you can see it as deleted, and I can see it has been restored. If you don't see anything insulting in that reply to me, a totally uncalled for insulting remark about my person, as I have never addressed that person on this board, since she has a history of posting insulting and abusive remarks to and about me on other boards, what abusive was there about Misfit's reply to it then that made somebody delete it?

Please enlighten us why a reply saying:

"And once this project is called Politically_Correct@home I won't be
rotting in the brig. Instead I'll be a detained guest."

was so abusive that it needed to be deleted? Applying your own logic - "In general, my policy is that unless abuse is clear and intended, or unless something is quite clearly offensive, then there is no need to remove a post. When there is some doubt, I'll leave it there, as will the moderators, at least until that doubt is removed." - it should not be deleted. But maybe one of your moderators, the one I told you about in my mail to you, is out of hands in this? As he has been so many times before. Signing me up on a site with an ad for prostitution is malignant, it shows how spiteful he is!

And the post I find abusive was meant just as insulting to me as all the other snide remarks and open insults that person usually address me with. If she claims she didn't mean to insult me, I expect an apology from her posted here very soon.

You chose who you want to have yourself and your project associated with, but please keep them off my back! I will not take anymore abuse from these people, neither here on this board or on any other boards!

You can read here how serial bullies behave.

And I'll take a look at that Wench page to see what you have said about us, the wenches, and I'll edit after my liking.

Thank you.


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Message 4991 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 18:15:17 UTC - in response to Message 4984.

...

In part, I think this disagreement stems from the fact that there are several meanings of the 'W-word'.

...

Explaining all meanings and contexts is exactly the purpose of a glossary, and since nobody else has taken on the task I have filled in that entry: [[Wench]] The crew can, of course, edit it to improve upon my start.

...


Are you now so political correct that you can't even say wench?

And done!

And I am definitely a wench. And a very able pirate also, I plunder as good as any of the guys here, I'm not a landlubber, I stay on the ship also when it's in port. And I take all the gold I'm offered as well.


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Message 4992 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 19:56:57 UTC - in response to Message 4991.

And I am definitely a wench. And a very able pirate also, I plunder as good as any of the guys here, I'm not a landlubber, I stay on the ship also when it's in port. And I take all the gold I'm offered as well.

And what a lovely profile pic you have too!
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Message 4994 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 21:28:33 UTC - in response to Message 4992.

And I am definitely a wench. And a very able pirate also, I plunder as good as any of the guys here, I'm not a landlubber, I stay on the ship also when it's in port. And I take all the gold I'm offered as well.

And what a lovely profile pic you have too!


Thank you. Yes, that bodice can make many a pirate forget all about his gold. ;-D


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Message 4995 - Posted: 24 Feb 2007 | 21:34:43 UTC - in response to Message 4991.


In part, I think this disagreement stems from the fact that there are several meanings of the 'W-word'.

Are you now so political correct that you can't even say wench?

Actually, no, I used the word elsewhere. My point in refering to it as the "W-word" was to imply that it's a word which has a wide range of meanings and emotional attachments for a variety of different people. Much like the "N-word". I think the strong feelings shown here demonstrate that.


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Message 4998 - Posted: 25 Feb 2007 | 12:09:33 UTC - in response to Message 4995.
Last modified: 25 Feb 2007 | 12:18:35 UTC


In part, I think this disagreement stems from the fact that there are several meanings of the 'W-word'.

Are you now so political correct that you can't even say wench?

Actually, no, I used the word elsewhere. My point in refering to it as the "W-word" was to imply that it's a word which has a wide range of meanings and emotional attachments for a variety of different people. Much like the "N-word". I think the strong feelings shown here demonstrate that.



If you with your expression "N-word" mean what I think you mean and compare that to the word "Wench" you are too far out, in my opinion. Geeezz, we are playing that we are on a Pirate ship, this board is bristling with words and expressions none of us use in our daily life, not without being incarcerated or attending special theme events. Being called or calling yourself a wench on this board is not even close to the use of the "N-word" out in society.

And what strong feelings? That this person won't use the word wench about herself, well, I'm not surprised, but I use it gladly about myself:

I am a Woman Entitled to Nothing but Complete Happiness!

What I have strong feelings about is receiving snide and insulting remarks about my person, a post where the only intention was to insult me. What was the reason for posting it if not for that? Why did this person address me in this? As I said, if I am wrong about this, an apology to me should be posted by this person, but none is showing so far. I have every right to be angry.

That a person can feel offended about a word like "wench" on a board like this, is beyond me. Again, we are playing here, if this fact has gone over somebody's heads, then they maybe have participated in the wrong project.


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Message 4999 - Posted: 25 Feb 2007 | 14:29:17 UTC - in response to Message 4998.
Last modified: 25 Feb 2007 | 14:40:04 UTC

If you with your expression "N-word" mean what I think you mean and compare that to the word "Wench" you are too far out, in my opinion.


I agree that the N-word is much more controversial, but my point is that both carry multiple meanings which can trigger a wide variety of emotional responses. I didn't know what you meant in using the word until you explained it. (Thanks for the glossary contribution.) Now we have three meanings of the word.

And I agree that folks on this site should not be offended by the word, given the context. But can you acknowledge that some people may see the word as offensive? Maybe you don't think they should, but that's separate issue which one can debate.

This morning I noticed on CNN that there is a conference on the N-word at Stillman college in Alabama. It mentions a Tupac Shakur song which he said stood for "Never Ignorant Getting Goals Accomplished." It looks like both Tupac and your Wench movement were/are aimed at turning a pejorative word into a positive ideal.

(Perhaps we should hold a conference on the many meanings of the W-word? We could have Misfit as the after dinner speaker.)
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Message 5002 - Posted: 25 Feb 2007 | 16:01:03 UTC - in response to Message 4999.

If you with your expression "N-word" mean what I think you mean and compare that to the word "Wench" you are too far out, in my opinion.


I agree that the N-word is much more controversial, but my point is that both carry multiple meanings which can trigger a wide variety of emotional responses. I didn't know what you meant in using the word until you explained it. (Thanks for the glossary contribution.) Now we have three meanings of the word.

And I agree that folks on this site should not be offended by the word, given the context. But can you acknowledge that some people may see the word as offensive? Maybe you don't think they should, but that's separate issue which one can debate.

This morning I noticed on CNN that there is a conference on the N-word at Stillman college in Alabama. It mentions a Tupac Shakur song which he said stood for "Never Ignorant Getting Goals Accomplished." It looks like both Tupac and your Wench movement were/are aimed at turning a pejorative word into a positive ideal.

(Perhaps we should hold a conference on the many meanings of the W-word? We could have Misfit as the after dinner speaker.)


I can acknowledge that people can be offended by certain words, but being offended on this board about being called a pirate or a wench is ridiculous. I can not acknowledge that somebody is hurling insults to me for calling myself a wench on this board.

And you are missing the point that that person addressed me, I have never called her a wench (which she is definitely not!), she addressed me with a very insulting statement about my person given the context she was using the word in! She hasn't even apologized yet, on the contrary, my posts are being minus rated just like when she and her friends were attacking me back before the ratings were disabled on the Seti boards. So let's see how the rating system on your board will behave now! How do you relate to minus attacks by the way? I think you'll see some here in the nearest future specially towards me and Misfit.

I wasn't aware of that the word "wench" was supposed to be pejorative on this board. When I signed up and started to read here, I saw it used all the time about women. So, are you saying that you endorse that view on women as that meaning of the word indicate?

Can you acknowledge that when the word "wench" is used in the pejorative meaning as in this post, then addressing me like that is insulting? Then why hasn't that post been deleted yet? Or why haven't you contacted your teammate and asked her to come and clear out the "misunderstanding" and apologize to me? And why is that person addressing me in the first place?


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Message 5004 - Posted: 25 Feb 2007 | 19:03:42 UTC - in response to Message 5002.

So let's see how the rating system on your board will behave now!


This does bring up another feature we are testing here which might prove useful on other BOINC projects. Each member of the crew now has only a small number of ratings points, which are only slowly replenished. This should prevent any one user from abusing the rating system (a 'minus attack') while still allowing the rating system to function normally.

I encourage everyone to give it a try. You can use your points to rate up those posts that you think are deserving of praise and attention, and rate down those posts which you don't think are worth viewing (and please use the rating system rather than the reporting system, unless there is extreme abuse). The idea is to create some amount of self-policing by the community of users.

I also remind you that each of you can control what level of rated posts you wish to see (or not see) by means of the forum preferences.

Thanks to everybody who helps test this new feature, and I'd welcome constructive feedback (in another thread - this one is now too long).

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