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Message boards : Team Talk : New standards for top teams

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Profile Wormholio
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Message 4237 - Posted: 8 Dec 2006 | 14:21:10 UTC

The idea of creating teams for BOINC was to encourage some competition, which would lead to more computers being provided to the cluster. That works, but now that several large teams have been established they dominate the ratings and the competition has settled down a bit.

There are other ways to measure performance. In particular, we can see how well a team does not by overall credit, but by the credit per member. This gives small teams an equal chance against the larger teams.

I've modified the top teams display to include both total and average credit per member. Only teams with more than one member are counted in these ratings. As you can see, the teams that were at the top still do well, but are not necessarily at the top.

I hope to be able to release new work this weekend, starting with something for our (remaining?) Mac crew members.
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Profile champ
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Message 4238 - Posted: 8 Dec 2006 | 15:41:53 UTC

Good idea. Well done!!
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Profile Michael Howe
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Message 4239 - Posted: 8 Dec 2006 | 21:53:06 UTC

That's pretty cool...
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Message 4240 - Posted: 9 Dec 2006 | 2:14:04 UTC
Last modified: 9 Dec 2006 | 2:16:40 UTC

Very nice, I hope this gets adopted across the projects. But you say teams of only one person aren't included. I'm the only member of my team (on this ship, anyway), and I show as #46 on the list.

[edit]Never mind, I see how that's working - I don't show up if I sort by either of the "per member" stats. Cool![/edit]

MJ
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Message 4243 - Posted: 9 Dec 2006 | 12:13:51 UTC

Excellent idea maybe in time other projects will follow suit
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Profile [B^S] Zain Upton
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Message 4247 - Posted: 10 Dec 2006 | 9:13:45 UTC

What do you mean large teams tend to dominate *innocent grin*

No no no! Its so unfair.

I am not serious! ... its a nice addition. May even look at adding something similar to my stats pages.

---
Zain Upton
BOINC Synergy - www.boincsynergy.com
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Message 4267 - Posted: 13 Dec 2006 | 5:42:06 UTC
Last modified: 13 Dec 2006 | 5:42:46 UTC

Zain! You really do exist! I thought you might be a myth. I was going to do a post Kari at Mythbusters. Oh, and her two helpers Jamie and Adam. :-D

Like the new idea of credit per team member too.
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Profile Wormholio
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Message 4269 - Posted: 13 Dec 2006 | 13:55:44 UTC

Here is a concern I have for these new rankings. One way the teams could respond to try to improve their scores is to encourage members who have not contributed in a while to come back. That is good. But another way is to just kick those folks out. In the end it is up to the teams to manage their own affairs, but we could actually be promoting such unfriendly behavior with these new rankings.

The team leaders have access to the e-mail addresses of all members, but there is no direct support for targeting particular types of members. However, the team management page makes it easy to remove members based on credit and RAC. So I see removal as the easier and therefore more likely alternative. I don't like that.

Meanwhile, there is a (fairly new) mass e-mail feature for the project administrator which can send e-mail to subsets of users (lapsed, contributing, successful, unsuccessful). It would be straightforward to modify this so that team leaders could send mass e-mails to their members (as long as we insure that only the leader of the team can send such messages, and they only go to team members).

So I don't think we want to suggest these new rankings unless/until there is also support like this for positive encouragement for lapsed or unsuccessful team members, rather than having the easiest alternative being to just drop these folks from the team.
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Nicolas
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Message 4271 - Posted: 13 Dec 2006 | 14:09:22 UTC
Last modified: 13 Dec 2006 | 14:12:32 UTC

I see what you mean, kicking anybody who doesn't have RAC > X. Maybe not even inactive people, but people with slow computers, or few computers. That definitely would be a Bad Thing (tm).

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Message 4277 - Posted: 13 Dec 2006 | 23:40:36 UTC

I've just took a look at my team, management functions. I see:

"Remove Members from <Team Name>
Removing a member will subtract their credit from team totals
"

Do I have to read it like "subtract their credit, possibly earned in future, from team totals"?

IIRC only on some one Boinc project it was working this way (called "old Seti way") that the past user's credit is traveling with her/him from team to team, the standard Boinc way should be that user's credit is added to him and his current team and the two sums won't change when the user moves to another address.

Or is the difference the kicking of the user? But then there would have to be a sum of user's credit, while he was signed to team <Team Name>.

Or is it only a non-bulletproof formulation?

I may stand corrected.
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Peter .-)

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Message 4278 - Posted: 14 Dec 2006 | 1:00:30 UTC - in response to Message 4277.

Pepo wrote:
I've just took a look at my team, management functions. I see:

"Remove Members from <Team Name>
Removing a member will subtract their credit from team totals
"


Well, this is interesting. I know that the database only keeps track of the credit and RAC for each user individually, and for the team as a whole. So if someone does get kicked out of a team then they can fight back: just join the team again, and get kicked out again. Each time they are kicked out the total team credit is reduced by the amount of credit they have, not what they accrued during their membership. Or this is a disincentive for kicking someone out.

Except that I checked the code, and that's now how it works. When you are out of the team your *future* credit does not go to the team, but there are no subtractions as this page would suggest. We need to get this changed.

I wonder if the phrasing in other languages is equally confusing.
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-- Eric Myers

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Message 4310 - Posted: 19 Dec 2006 | 5:56:24 UTC

I have no idea what's going on.
Except the rum seems to be gone.
Why is the rum always gone?
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Message 4311 - Posted: 19 Dec 2006 | 9:09:19 UTC - in response to Message 4310.

I have no idea what's going on.
Except the rum seems to be gone.
Why is the rum always gone?


Because i have drunken all the rum!!!! Yummi, yummi!!!!
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Profile Mchl
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Message 4565 - Posted: 11 Jan 2007 | 2:09:15 UTC - in response to Message 4269.

Here is a concern I have for these new rankings. One way the teams could respond to try to improve their scores is to encourage members who have not contributed in a while to come back. That is good. But another way is to just kick those folks out. In the end it is up to the teams to manage their own affairs, but we could actually be promoting such unfriendly behavior with these new rankings.


Grave concern ye have cap'n. Indeed many a time have I seen sailors being thrown away from their ships just because they didn't work enough... Such approach seems appealing to some bosuns... Me on the other hand, I like to keep every mate who gets aboard, cos' you never now if he knows something I'd like to know but I don't know that, and I don't even know I'd like to know it... <goes on like that for some minutes> Anyways, I don't have to feed'em, so why not let'em stay?

Meanwhile, there is a (fairly new) mass e-mail feature for the project administrator which can send e-mail to subsets of users (lapsed, contributing, successful, unsuccessful). It would be straightforward to modify this so that team leaders could send mass e-mails to their members (as long as we insure that only the leader of the team can send such messages, and they only go to team members).


Arrr!!! Now that would be handy me dear cap'n. Me hast an idea though. How about an automated greeting message from team founder to every new team member?

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Me Pirrrate name be Mad William Flint an' don't ye dare t' call me with any other name me lad!
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